Having recently purchased this amazing transport, the above linked review perfectly sums up how I feel about the Audiolab 6000CDT. Within . The CD-200 also has a new transport, the CD-5020A, designed by TEAC for audio use. However, whereas the No. Subtotal. This is very useful on. 5 features Philips' new CDM 12 2x-speed industrial CD-ROM mechanism with a linear-tracking pickup and a. Arcam Alpha 9 CD player: $1599. Also known as S/N ratio. As you can imagine, the lower the number the better! 2. 5101. Marantz CD6007. I think PST is better sound quality- the music comes alive. 016 euro. Location: Maine. (I think it was a CDP-501. Transport used is a VRDS-0 with Sanyo SF-C93 / SF-C99 laser. High-end players will also offer. I haven’t had problems with CD players myself, but there’s no doubt that lasers and transport mechanisms do break down. A CD player is a much higher precision machine than your pickup truck. anon32455950 August 21, 2021, 9:04am 6 Maybe off topic…. I suspect that not hifi dvd players do some processing on cd plaback or have very bad spdif output. The No. We have researched hundreds of brands and picked the top brands of cd players, including Onkyo, Marantz, YAMAHA, PIONEER, Cambridge Audio. 24 was an evolution of its 20-bit 508 CD player. laptop to DAC. ) We connected it to my system at. It should sound gloriously with a modern DAC in playing CDs. This one is simply a CD transport with mains power. But a good resource is equally important. Those can be used as a CD. #3. Report Comment. good point. For example the Line Magnetic 515 uses a Sony KSS 213 (discontinued) is a $14 transport. Price £1750. CD transports need outboard D/A converters as they just have the CD read mechanism inside. It’s galvanic isolation makes a. 2 Jay's Audio Lab CD T2 MK 3 3 P. The Transport. I had made up my mind that I was going to purchase a Music Hall CD 25. EUR 995. I read somewhere that it's now "illegal" (or will soon become illegal) to include analog outputs on Blu-Ray players because it's a way of bypassing copy protection. They say a jack of all trades is the master of none. Option 2: Placebo. all-metal chassis to eliminate performance-robbing vibration. Think of it as a CD transport. 10 (along with Esoteric's two other converters). With the CD60, Marantz releases a CD player that wants to pick up on the recent revival of the music CD. 33-inch touch screen sitting on the top. The player will recognise a CD and output in stereo. The Emotiva ERC-3 Differential Reference CD Player/Digital Transport In Use. Yes, this is where we are in high end audio today. However, you will easily go with the first case when looking at the impressive Cambridge Audio CDX CD player specifications. If the CD player has a good transport, you are comparing the same AVR's. The Marantz CD6007 CD Player is highly recommended for its exceptional audio quality, premium design, and solid build quality, making it a standout. The suspension, cover and turntable platter are made of 100% real carbon fibre. I did have an '87 H/K that lasted a long time. Little back ground story is - I was looking for CD transport for fun, so I find things from Pro-ject, Audiolab, Cambridge and Primare. With this transport, the DAC didn't sound like the $15k DAC that it is. The 6000CDT is a dedicated CD transport incorporating the same slot-loading mechanism as audiolab’s flagship CD player, the 8300CD. Also, there is a rising number of audiophiles who swear that a CD played in a fine disc transport in a fine system can sometimes sound better than its streaming counterpart. That is, the CD transport doesn’t produce any basic sonic nasties. Bottom line: This upgrade path is real. The digital signal from the transport was then fed to the processing. This one is simply a CD transport with mains power. Change Up to 5 Discs During Play, 40 Track Programming. Since the OPPO laser mechanism is no longer available, PS Audio was forced to make a choice. Unlike your average CD player most of the CEC’s machines, including the TL5, don’t even have a DAC built in. Traditionally, transports are more expensive than players because they are hand crafted instead of being mass-market products. 5's transport mechanism is mounted on the same sprung 12-lb lead-brick assembly as in the '31. Dedicated CD Transport. This was Teac’s all out assault at CD transports: extreme inplementation of the VRDS system. 3. 1 CD data without upsampling. Rotel CD11 Tribute. They are now one of the largest suppliers of transport mechanisms in the world, and make complete CD players for some companies. 1) A method of reading the digital data form the surface of the disk (transport) 2) A method of converting the digital data to an analogue signal (DAC) 3) A method of amplifying the analogue data (AMP) About this item. The CD-S700 & CXC use the same transport, Sanyo SF-P101N, the same one used for all of the former CA Azur series, 351C, 651C, & 851C, & all the Marantz 5003-6003 thru 5005-6005 CDP's. . The $1200 D-105u, the top of Luxman's CD-player line, is novel in its twin-triode vacuum-tube amplification in the analog output stage. The Hegel Mohican is a starkly elegant steel box weighing 14. Roksan Attessa CD Transport. Aug 22, 2021. So he knows what he’s doing. #14. $549. The PS Audio transport has the I2S and the Wyred4sound dac’s also accept the I2S input. since you already have DAC you need pure CD transport without inner DAC uder $1000 the best option I can think of is the Cambridge Audio CXC . The lavish engineering thoughtfulness is matched by every satiny panel and control surface. Sparkler Audio S503 Spiral Disc Player ($1,500 USD) This simple top-loading CD player from the mind of the former head designer of 47 Laboratories is old-fashioned through and through. According to quite a few the Pro-Ject RS2 Transport is superb sounding and improves further with an optional linear power supply. Again, the CEC TL-5 is surprisingly affordable for the quality of sound, starting out at $3,095. No SACD, DVD-A, Blu-Ray or other disc formats are supported and, of course, it outputs a digital stream only, no analog. It's a CD transport, rather than a CD player, meaning it will simply read the data on the disc. Transport Of Delight. It's best to consider these hook-ups as no more than a 'get started' measure. As I explain in this video, I always tell them i. This has been my experience regardless of the player or transport, or its price. Two years ago, Simaudio introduced the Moon Evolution 750D CD transport/DAC ($11,999), billed as "the world's first true 32-bit asynchronous DAC. i know of one dac which takes a 12 volt tube, namely the exemplar dac. The streamer sounds exactly the same as red book CDs on the CD transport on the ARC CD9SE… but better when Qobuz streams higher resolution files (btw, equal to my really good vinyl playback). Best Convenient: Cambridge Audio AXC35 Single-Disc CD Player with High Performance Wolfson. Old ideas die. Sony CD player model xxxxx -> output Sony. Aug 19, 2019. Comparing the Red Book (on my Sony player) with the SACD was not a fair fight. Priced at $4000, it represents the top of the Esoteric line that includes the $2000 D-10 and $1000 D-500 CD transports. This is 99. The Mini-CD MK2 has a set of analog RCA outputs, for easy connection to almost any amplifier, receiver, or powered speakers. Unlike your average CD player most of the CEC’s machines, including the TL5, don’t even have a DAC built in. 7" wide by 3. 42" deep. Rotel CD14. This is a review and detailed measurements of the Cayin Mini-CD MKII CD transport and stereo player. Oak Ridge, Tennessee. As can be seen below, in Nov 2023 neither Cambridge CXC Transport nor Nuprime CDT 8 Pro were recommended by key experts who publish Home Audio CD Players recommendations. Not through the CD disc drive, of course. This entirely new design sports the latest 24-bit Wolfson DAC chips. Reviews and Tech Articles . While I was researching about CD transport, (I just want one. Some players will offer one set of RCA connections that passes the output of the built-in DAC, plus a digital coaxial or optical output if you want to use an external DAC. Certainly, vinyl surpassed it for a few years, but of late the CD is coming back and sales are, if not robust, good. the cd player is a system that have both the transport and the DAC, a standalone DAC in only a DAC. In today’s computer-driven marketplace the C31 CD player can just as reasonably be considered a “DAC with transport. A. Brandin Cooks over 31. Roksan Attessa CD Transport. Does a separate transport and DAC sound better than an integrated player? As always in audio, there are advantages to either method, but there is one unique clear advantage when taking the integrated route. S. Best looking CD player — LEAK CDT. 1kHz in native form. Nevertheless, here we are in 2018 with the Cambridge Audio CXC, seemingly a unicorn in the audio world of under $500 components. The advantage of using a CD player as a transport gives you the flexibility to experiment with different external DAC's to tailor the sound to your preference. You could simply buy a basic CD Player like a Yamaha CD-S300 (~£170). Will mostly use with a Space Tech Labs DAC. Those can last over 10,000 hours. 1. Been down that road. DVD Player vs. the record spot. Its sole purpose is to spin up CDs to the correct and stable speed so that a laser can read the pits and lands that are encoded into the polycarbonate layer of the disc. That's a difficult price point, your betwixt and between with there be a great many good players under £500 which in fairness has been dominated by the Marantz cd6006 for a number of years. (I think it was a CDP-501. Reply. " The new Moon Evolution 650D ($7999) is physically and functionally identical to the 750D. We know you’d much rather hear the sound of Hendrix’s fingers flying up and. ” Either way, its performance is uncompromising. Up-samples all PCM signals. . Meaning the combo was priced around £1,130 or £1,210 with the connecting QED coax cable in added to the mix. I have a large CD collection and a really old CD player from the 1990s. All blu ray players will play CD as stereo and are designed to do so. Aug 23, 2018. The Philips Pro2 just for the mechanism is $500. Yamaha CD-NT670D. The two systems, Teac VRDS-701 CD Player and Teac VRDS-701T CD Transport, will be offered in a choice of black or silver, with the proven emphasis on the particularly elegant design line that evokes the charm of the long-gone heyday of hi-fi in the 1960s and 1970s. Slack, Nov 3, 2019. . It's in the mid price category yet very well-built. weight: 10. This place was epic in comparison to what Philadelphia had to offer and the object of my stepfather’s eye was a Compact Disc player. It is on that irrefutable logic that I have established my new baseline for reviewing CD players: Let's you and I find the best player we can for $10,000—and let's start with Audio Note's combination of CDT. 23 db. I currently use an older generation P. 0 6. Rather like Kenwood about 15 years who had some great CD players (the DP7090 was vastly underrated) but seem to be overlooked from the more popular brands. Other components and technology leverage Denafrips DAC experience. Table of Contents. Meaning the combo was priced around £1,130 or. ” for engaging/disengaging the internal 4x upsampler. The original TL1 CD transport was conceived as a challenge to the digital world, making full use of CEC’s legacy in traditional mechanical engineering. Here Are Our Picks for the Best CD Players of 2023: The Best Overall CD Player: McIntosh MCD350 2-Channel SACD/CD Player. Type: CD transport; Transport Mechanism: Philips. One big change is that Primare has abandoned the CD31's fully balanced differential architecture. Equipment List. That, combined with a read-ahead digital buffer, is supposed to be able to read damaged discs better than other CD transports. The BCD-3 turns out to be a fantastic CD transport. Each half is a standard Meridian size, the same width as the 263 DAC. 681 Network Player / DAC. 00 EVO CD. I think it is more reliable and less risky of disc damage. The best ever made. This is not only possible when using the internal transport but even configurable for use with external sources. 00. dirty and old surface) will be higher than influence of transport. Description. And thanks to its all-digital outputs it works in perfect harmony with our CXA60 and CXA80 integrated amplifiers. The California/Texas company’s new Urd CD player is a CD transport: it contains no DAC of its own. Magico S5 speaker, MSB Select DAC & Digital Director, MSB Select Transport, Nakamichi 700 XLE cassette deck, Taiko Audio Extreme Server & Extreme Switch, Zayin Audio Stargate Switch, Tripoint Troy Signature NG. This can be advantageous as more resources can be allocated to the laser and CD reading mechanism in general, as well as more robust casing, all to reduce jitter. So either the UB9000 ain’t a good CD player or it is and that’s as good as it’s going to get with a cd which is unfortunate and I was told nonsense. You can choose a CD player with a high-quality built-in DAC or upgrade to an external DAC. It has unbalanced analog outputs, and RCA and optical digital outputs. This Exposure XM CD player is a half-width chassis design sporting a top loader disc mechanism with a magnetic puck. You'll have to check with the manual as to how you engage the analogue output. So it seems very reasonable to conclude that the Denon DCD-755AR CD player not only applies its Alpha Processing to its analogue outputs (measured noise: -113. To rip a CD you would need an internal or external optical data drive for your PC/laptop/Mac. Our high end MOON 260D with optional 32-bit DAC combines high-performance, USB input and CD playback all into one chassis. Equipped with a Philips CDPRO2 LF. Wanted to get opinions on the Denon DCD 1600NE and Yamaha CD-S1000 versus other higher end transports. It also handles music from flash drives inserted into its front-panel USB socket, which allows for significantly more storage space than optical discs. made low-end turntables for the Japanese audio giants. Best transport-only player — Cambridge Audio CXC v2. Jun 29, 2023. They are flexible in their own unique way but owners of CD transport and CD player may not see it that way. Most CD players and CD transports are. Edit. This box from Audiolab, the 6000CDT, is different from the. High quality audio CD transport – for detailed playback of music CDsCustom designed S3 Servo. May 08, 2015. The digital out of the DVD player I picked up for $35 sounds absolutely fantastic as a CD transport, so I'm sticking with that. But with Sparkler Audio’s Ether integrated amplifier, the sound was clean and up-front. was looking at the following: Onkyo C-7030. Some audiophiles believe that DACs can sound different, and so enjoy the flexibility of swapping out the DAC without having to buy a whole new CD player. 30 to recognize that it is. Product Design: Primarily designed and built in California, with PCBs also made in Utah and Nevada. The price may not be that low, but it offers the same beautiful design as the high-end Model 30 and Model 40n. Denon DCD-800NE. News, Tips & Reviews. The DVD-2900 is a single-disc player, but it's a universal player. So you have an old-ish CD player and a Schiit Modi. Designed specifically to do one thing only. First the cost difference (between good analog and good digital) was large to get as good as analog… and the minimum investment was $100K… that dropped… then over the last ten years. In this video we review the features and functionality of both the CD35 modular CD player and DD35 CD transport that may make them the perfect addition to your system. New, easier to read LED display. The CD t is the latest addition to Cyrus’s long line of highly accomplished products. . Then, by way of the CXC’s digital outputs (Coax or Toslink), that data is sent to a digital to analog converter to turn bits into. Dvd blue ray player are ugly for listening cd via spif. Audio Perfect Wave Transport which has served me beautifully for 8 years. Transport and DAC Where am I going to get the best Digital playback? Going with a high end CD player or a transport and DAC? Also, what's the difference between a transport and a cd player. 1 can be made these days at the price range when it was available. Audio Perfect Wave Transport which has served. CEC TL1-N BELT DRIVE CD Transport. One could argue that the 'C555ES and '2900 are compromised when it comes to CD. These culminate in the duo we have here, the £2150 CD Box RS2 T CD transport and £1750 Pre Box RS2 Digital DAC/headphone amp/preamp, available in either black or silver. The CD-200 also has a new transport, the CD-5020A, designed by TEAC for audio use. It is very good. The 272 wiped the floor with it. OUR BELIEFS. I am very happy with cdt-8, except for the remote. The Spiral can also be used as. 1Pro-Ject RS2 CD BOX Transport. . Yamaha CD-S303. Jan 29, 2013. That wouldn't apply to CD players because CD players don't have copy. The Wadia 861 cd player has several outputs,. NAD seems to have followed the same style notes for decades, and the C 538 bears many similarities to its forebears. Yes, this is where we are in high end audio today. if you are willing to spend more the Cyrus cdt or the other pure transports. Richer Sounds have a deal available to buy the Leak 130 and CDT for ¬£1099 with a saving ¬£249. You can apply the same theory to any component in the hi-fi chain. Jay's has beaten Esoteric at 1/10th the price from many reports. CD Transport TEAC CD 5020A-AT; RCA 1 digital output; Toslink 1 digital output;The Cambridge Audio CXC is a CD transport. The BCD-3 turns out to be a fantastic CD transport. The original PerfectWave Transport (PWT) used an OPPO laser mechanism. I definitely don't want to spend that much. I would also recommend avoiding used transports. A pair of RCAs accommodate the use of an external word clock (10MHz), and a tiny toggle switch marked “UpS. Considering another CD player / transport, need 2 within my business. Media Platform Type: Digital. The ERC-3 is a far better CD player than the OPPO 103 is; and, adding the DC-1 to the OPPO will not make it perform any better as a CD player. Don't go thurther. 1Pro-Ject RS2 CD BOX Transport. There are two optical, two coaxial, and – probably of most interest – a USB-B computer connection that will accept files at up to 384kHz/32-bit and DSD256/11. Though for the price, this is an. In practice it does, but how much depends on your specific hardware. A true high-performance, high-end, affordable digital product that meets current and future needs. Claiming that one digital source sounds different from another is bogus. CD players without built-in DACs are called “transports. Connect via RCA from the front left and right outputs. The CD-200 is the new CD-only player from TASCAM, the professional-audio division of TEAC (footnote 1). Proponents of the expensive CD transports will tell you all sorts of things about how crucial the clock timing or the vibration damping or what form of ancient sorcery was used in the creation of their $1,000 product. A stand-alone CD transport, Paul Rigby wonders if it measures up to other integrated players, its immediate competition and most of all, how it stands up to. Buyer's Guide. So far, any DAC I have teamed with this transport increases the overall performance to a higher level then with my other transports. Best Saving: Onkyo DXC390 6 Disc CD Changer,Black. Think I paid $275 CDN for my Teac about 4 years ago - close to $200 US. thanks! System: Rogue RP-1, Rogue ST-100, Martin Logan Montis, Chord Qutest dac. Pflughaupt. 1 Khz. cephas February 11, 2023, 4:26pm 4. Ian White March 17, 2023. The NAD's at least 12 years old. Technical description. Used as a CD player, the CD5 puts in a creditable performance for its reasonable price, one that’s full of musical life and. Teac CD Player CD-P650-B. CD Transport. When Sony/Phillips Announced their new Super Audio CD format (SACD) in 1999/2000, Sony opened a marketing office in NYC to advertise and promote the new format. wav -> compared to ref. Obvious the bandwidth of coax is higher but in practice modern Toslink can perform better (I can do 176 kHz over Toslink) However as a CD player is 2 channel, 16 bit, 44. All of the analog section from the CD player was removed and only the necessary circuitry needed to play a CD and get a digital signal from it were left intact. . I did have an '87 H/K that lasted a long time. Since its inception, CEC has reigned as the foremost among analog player manufacturers. Joined: Oct 31 2005 - 6:02pm. although many dacs and cd players in production use 6 volt tubes, there arev some cd players which take 12 volt tubes. Marantz CD6007 ($599) The Marantz CD6007 is a versatile CD Player, which includes support for hi-res digital music playback via USB. The Pro-Ject Pre Box RS2 Digital and Pro-Ject CD Box RS2 T are designed to work in tandem to deliver the best sound quality from CD’s. The Denon DCD-900NE is a single drawer CD player that currently retails for $550 . The cd players are available for purchase. The 9000CDT is Audiolab’s ‘flagship’ CD transport. Probably brand new with one year warranty. and I do like the 103, currently using it in second system as a CD Player. Cyrus Audio i9-XR Integrated Amp and CDi-XR CD Player. The transport mechanism works well with minimum fuss and not much noise. Bill Mac Forum Resident. You can play hi-res PCM music up to 24-bit/192kHz and DSD128. Ever wonder what's the difference between a CD transport and a CD player and more importantly - why's it matter? Audio Advisor is here to help explain and gi. Firstly, their earlier player are considerably brighter sounding to my ear than the later ones. A table-lamp made from a shellac'd, puffed-up frog. Digital: Rockna Wavedream Net streamer, Lampizator Pacific 2 dac Analog: Technics SP10 MK2, Trans Fi Audio Terminator Pro tonearm, BMC MCCI phono stage, DaVa field coil cartridge Preamp: Passive Goldpoint SA2XM-I (Timbre Audio silver cable rewired) Amp: Benchmark AHB2 monoblocks Speakers: Tempo Electric EP1(modified. It lost detail, the bass was muddied and the highs lacked resolution and air. Definitely others. I was wondering if any of you folks could steer. But influence of the CD quality (clean and new vs. I'm currently using a Cambridge Audio 540c as a transport which sounds great, but have seen it mentioned by a few people of the benefits using DVD players for the function. Comparing the Red Book (on my Sony player) with the SACD was not a fair fight. 861 Power Amplifier. Reason being either way you still need a DAC for both solution. 5 m. . This is not a money-saving ploy. Most Blu-Ray players only have digital outputs (usually just HDMI). shug4476, May 21, 2022. An CD transport only has digital outputs. But playing CD vs CD in both units it becomes very clear that the Rs2 is lightyears better. It has all the best bits of everything the company knows about silver disc spinning. Remote control iR14. (Not the new one) I just got here by random google search. ” for engaging/disengaging the internal 4x upsampler. The CD14 CD player doesn’t try to be anything but. The CXC spins CDs and retrieves the audio data with perfect precision so you can hear things that you’ve never heard before in tracks you’ve heard 100 times. The unit is powered by a pair of 18650 batteries that are rechargeable via the supplied outboard unit for up to 7. Best value for the money — Rotel CD14 MkII. Good CD player vs. vincei. Nothing to stress over and probably undetectable in blind testing. There are a lot of threads here that debate this, but most people are comparing a $300 CD player vs a 5 K streamer, or vice versa. Externally, the MCD600 is classic McIntosh. Comparing its sound using its onboard DAC might reveal more about how well, or not, DVD/CD players compare to stand alone units. Marantz Super Audio CD Player. The CD32 has only one Burr-Brown PCM1704 24-bit/96kHz digital-to-analog converter per channel and a single DF1704 digital filter; the CD31 doubled that complement. No need for any extra mechanism to move the disc into position. It supports 24-bit/192kHz and DSD 5. dirty and old surface) will be higher than influence of transport. This configuration is said to provide high linearity with low distortion and that hard-to-quantify musicality found in tubed products. Not that CEC don’t make their own DACs; indeed there will be a partnering DAC, the DA5, for this transport coming out soon at £3999. Today Yamaha sells a CD player that comes in any $7,000. Unlike many affordable disc-spinning. After writing my very favorable review of Marantz's PM5003 integrated amplifier ($449. The left half is the transport mechanism itself, the right houses the decoder, control circuits, and digital output. Esoteric CD/SACD transport. There is no analog. Ignoring the Google dongle, look how good. Wow! Now that's a vintage CD player if I ever saw one! Early CD tech is really cool. until the other day when I ran my LG BH200 through my Topping D50. I have never seen this player in real life but if my experience with the 861 is anything to go by, then the drawer mechanism will be fine. Some clarification on terminology a CD Player includes a disc transport and a Digital to Analog conversion section. And that’s a problem. This is the latest (and last) version of the CD Pro-family of player modules — The CD Pro 2LF (version VAU 1255/21LF). Let’s look at which format has more advantages, CDs or streaming. Sparkler Audio S503 Spiral Disc Player ($1,500 USD) This simple top-loading CD player from the mind of the former head designer of 47 Laboratories is old-fashioned through and through. 5101. This is not only possible when using the internal transport but even configurable for use with external sources. Hey Nonoise, I have the SPL Director in-house for review. Connect via RCA from the front left and right outputs. Just about every CD player will come with a pair of analogue cables in the box. With something like an old philips based player, im not sure the lines will ever cross. To the best of my knowledge, no other CD player on the planet (save this one from Shanling). I have a Timbre DAC. The TL-5 is a perfect cosmetic match with the CEC DA-5 DAC. Signal to noise ratio. CD players were generally hard to come by, but I had a friend who worked for Sony, and he came over with his new toy: Sony's next-to-top-of-the-line CD player. A CD Player, Transport, And DAC – All In One. It’s a CD transport, rather than a CD player, meaning it will simply read the data on the disc, requiring an external DAC to handle all the digital-to-analogue conversion. This feature is made possible by a communication link between the No. Luxman D-105u CD player. The DACs on the Oppo are also both well designed and well implemented. Unfortunately the modified Music Hall CD 25. Cheers George. Solid construction with distinctive glass and chrome finish. The small percentage of Mac's does not invite the malicious interest that PC's do. Here, the PerfectWave made strides from the CD layer that comes with each disc. A CD player's transport is the tray you put the CD into and the mechanism that spins it and reads the information on the disc. ' My opinions expressed here do not represent those of the AVForums or its. It was early 1984, and Compact Discs were simply the shit. The aluminum finish on the front of the player is a great choice for this price range, ensuring the player doesn’t have a cheap look. The actual discs (and there weren’t many of them out at the time but they were very sought after) cost a hefty $25-plus per album, which is over $60. 1. The Rossini Player from British company dCS, which I reviewed along with the Rossini Clock in our December 2016 issue, was an example of this last category: the Player costs $28,499, the Clock $7499. Virtually every CD player out there uses a transport mechanism between $4-$30. So a CD player has a. The core of a transport is its disc mechanism. Here The output of my Onkyo C7030 if find to be much cleaner and more dynamic than the afterthought DAC in my amp and too close to call when using my Modi. 5.